Man, I feel this. Infinite growth is an insane concept.
Well made second-hand > disposable Walmart/Amazon plastic
Reduce spending. Reuse second-hand wares. Recycle what no one wants.
Infinite growth in a finite system has a name: it’s called cancer.
Just don’t mention that it’s what makes the stock market go round or people lose their shit when they realize you can’t retire at 65 by magically making money from hoarding it through compound interest.
“the young people”
So they’ve stopped calling everyone under the age of 45 millennials?
Ooof, that stings. I’ve been thrifty and anti-consumer for years, but I’m also 50. I hate admitting I’m no longer one of “the young people.”
It warms my heart to hear young folks not buy into the infinite treadmill of consumption.
it comes at a social cost though.
i have lost a lot of friends because I live below my ‘means’. whereas most folks I meet are ‘struggling’ because they are living beyond theirs.
Especially travel and restaurants. consumption is now re-branded as ‘experience’.
dude, eating good food with others and travelling really are experiences. No branding is necessary.
they are consumer goods like any other.
you can cook a meal at home and travel locally. but few are interested in this because it is not a ‘display of wealth’, the way your week in Bali is or your tiktok dining blog.
Going to Bali- absolutely an experience Going to Bali so you can show off your luxurious lifestyle to your online following - display of wealth.
I’d say it all comes down to your motivations. I think travel can be very rewarding and a chance for growth. I also don’t have any social media and I don’t really care what people think of me outside of my family and a few close friends.
Yeah, but no one had to “rebrand” anything. They have always been experiences.
I’m glad my social circle pretty much revolves around people who all hate consumerism equally. We do like to travel though.
You know what sucks about this? How prices on used items and thrift items have gone up…
Damn you Mackelmore!
Yeah for a while going to goodwill and stuff became trendy so they pumped those prices up. I see just awful stuff priced at new or near New prices which is insane
I went to find a used cassette player, just a little boom box. Found a crappy brand one beat up and with a $40 price tag. Gtfo with that. I can buy a brand new Sony for $50
Oh that’s so true. I have looked through all the thrift stores in my surrounding and they all had really bad clothes for bad prices. When you can get a new top in a size that fits for 5€ at H&M it makes no sense to pay 12€ for an H&M shirt that has holes in it and doesn’t fit right just because it is from a thrift store.
I don’t buy clothes often, I have much more than enough from when I was a teen. But I think that when I do, in the future, I’ll just go straight to a normal store. I don’t see the sense in spending the time and energy if it isn’t worth it at all.
There’s also this thing now where “trendy” thrift stores go to regular thrift stores and pick them clean of anything worth buying, then they Jack up the price.
I look for thrift stores in or around proper rich neighborhoods. There’s one I go to that routinely has stuff from last year or that no one’s ever worn, tags and all.
I had to buy “business casual” clothes for a work trip and went to a thrift store. I found a pair of pants that was $15, but they didn’t fit great. Since I needed at least two pairs of pants I went to Costco and they had brand new Dockers for the same price.
they are going back down now that supply chain is stabilized.
my car has dropped $5000 in value between this year and last year.
I have never bought a car, I looked at prices for new cars last year and I was blown away. I didn’t know at the time that they were at an all time high
I’m GenX and my body is still ready for this. Let’s fucking gooooo
stop making shitty stuff that will only last a couple of years we are perfectly fucking capable of it
But muh profits!
What’s are some of yall’s less obvious “always buy second hand” items?
Crockery, cutlery, pressure cookers and computer peripherals are some things I think it makes no sense to buy new. 2nd hand they’re usually under a tenth the price and often better quality.
I’ve heard some arguments that buying 2nd hand cars is usually better for the climate owing to how much of a car’s lifetime carbon generation is the manufacturing.
The better quality is the key here. The shit made today are intentionally made to be replaced.
Pyrex is the best example. The old-school Pyrex logo means it’s made from really tough glass whereas the newer logo means it’s shit and will shatter when going from hot to cold (oven to countertop).
I wondered about this and apparently it’s a bit more complicated, funnily enough since 2007 European Pyrex is the older style borosilicate glass again
Yep, there’s an excellent video by Ann Reardon talking about this.
Tools! With the exception of a few big power tools like a table saw or miter saw, where the new safety features make it worthwhile, I get everything I can used. I prefer stuff passed down from family with sentimental value, but I get a lot of my tools from Everything is Free, junk stores, yard sales, estate clean outs, swap shops etc.
Older tools tend to be simpler, easier to fix, and remarkably sturdy. I’ve read that the metallurgy wasn’t as good sixty+ years ago so they overbuilt them a bit to compensate, and then decades of use weaned out the weaker ones, so anything left still working is basically survivorship-bias guaranteed. I’ve got a drill press that’s been in the family for four generations and will probably outlast my grandkids.
They’re cheaper, sturdier, easier to fix, generally well-documented online (sometimes better than the new stuff), and they don’t come with sheaves of unnecessary styrofoam and plastic packaging. And they have history and stories in them, even if I don’t always know what those stories are.
Adding to this, my local library has a library of things which includes a lot of tools. From niche saws to power drills everyone could use.
Got to be careful with old cutlery and kitchenwares, and test for lead.
applied science actually has a really good video about leaded glass. And it’s tendency to cause shenanigans, i don’t remember much from it, so you should just go watch it.
Definitely most furniture (i.e., without cushions so you avoid bed bugs). New furniture is incredibly expensive and (seems to be) lower quality. Second hand furniture can still be expensive but it’s usually heavily discounted, especially if someone is trying to get rid of it quickly.
Local thrift shops are a good option of course, but also try garage/yard sales, Craigslist, OfferUp, etc. If your area has estate sales you can find some pretty killer deals on good furniture there too.
If you actually need one (most don"t), I wouldn’t buy a truck sold on the North American market since about 2005.
Even if you do need a truck, most of the models marketed here are stupidly oversized in all the areas that DON’T matter. As a builder, I don’t need to be lifted into the stratosphere and have a teeny-tiny bed! I want to be able to fit an entire sheet of plywood in the bed and two people in the cab… ideally without having to hoist myself up into the seat!
Clothes, furniture, equipment related to hobbies… Most things
Honestly a better question might be what do people prefer buying new?
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Crockery and cutlery? Have you never been to an estate sale? I would never buy that stuff new.
getting a fuel efficent compact car, new or used, is what is best.
way way too many have huge gas guzzlers, used or old. your 1990 4Runner that gets 10mpg and has horrible emissions isn’t saving the environment.
I feel like I could learn a lot from these people
Start at freecycle.org
There’s also local Buy Nothing/Everything is Free groups which may be more active depending on where you are
Also freegle and as you say, results may vary.
My hack is sign up for affluent areas near you and be prepared to travel a lil more.
Any book recommendations for Degrowth?
Less Is More: How Degrowth Will Save the World
So you don’t have to buy a copy you can just take it out of the library here. http://libgen.is/search.php?req=less+is+more+how+degrowth&open=0&res=25&view=simple&phrase=1&column=def
Libraries are the greatest degrowth asset. We need everything libraries w/ attached repair shops.
No.
It’s as simple as stop buying shit you don’t need, and rather than buy new stuff, replace/fix/renew old stuff.
Like… stop buying a new car on lease every 2/3 years. buy a car and keep it for 10+ years.
Can anyone provide a resource for how to break this habit and maybe learn new methods of reducing it in my life
No just stop the habit
Wow thanks I’m cured… lol
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first of all, the irony in this comment is incredible. Second of all, literally just start buying used shit first and foremost (it’s already out there, using it is better for the environment) and if you do buy something new, try and buy something that you know you can get a good lifetime out of.
have a proper sit down, and think about what you really need to keep going in life. Focus on that. I’m not saying you should drop every hobby you’ve ever had, but if you collect newly released shit, maybe pivot into finding older stuff that’s interesting to collect. If one of your hobbies has a consumable material/s maybe think about how you can better fill that gap. Perhaps try a different hobby every once in a while.
I’ve always enjoyed computer hardware, i recently got my hands on a few older thinkpad models. x20 series and an x50 series. Both used, both seen some shit in their day and age. Gave me a handful of usable laptops, most of the parts i bought for them were used. All of them are fantastic machines though.
Rude. My dude was just asking for advice and wanted to learn more.
idk, i was just pointing out that it was somewhat ironic, that we’re on lemmy, a result of modern internet consumption (which is yet another problem) talking about the concept of degrowth, and this person was asking about a book about it.
That’s pretty ironic. There’s nothing wrong in something being ironic, irony is literally just when two counterintuitive things are in the same place (for lack of me googling the definition to properly explain it lol, look more irony)
Regardless, i still provided my thoughts on how it could be done, i feel like i provided something of substance.
E-Books are a thing, as are libraries, which allow you to borrow a book and return it. You also have the option of buying books second hand and then sell it again or give it away. That is really one of the key parts of degrowth. As soon as you share things, you need less things as a group. Hence the impact is much lower.
Besides a paperback book has a climate impact of 1kg of CO2. The average US American emits 4.6t per year just by driving their car. The impact of reading books is a complete joke against that and again no libraries, no second hand or anything else to reduce the impact.
Also books are really incredibly usefull resources. They are much better at actually explaining more complex ideas, then shorter articles.
So please do not just presume, somebody is going out to buy something. For the most part the big choices an individual can make on personal consumption are housing, transport and diet.
i know i just thought it was funny, let me have my 7 words or however many they are, of amusement smh.
I mentioned second hand stuff, as well as other non physical methods of cosumption in my comment, so some of this is quite redundant. The tidbit on carbon emissions is interesting though.
Also books are really incredibly usefull resources. They are much better at actually explaining more complex ideas, then shorter articles.
i mean yeah, i just don’t know how much one would need to explain the concept of “hey just don’t buy things, or if you do minimize the impact of it.” But that’s just me i suppose.
So please do not just presume, somebody is going out to buy something.
i guess so, but owning things is an inevitability in a materialist society. Even if you’re homeless, you’re still going to own something, even if it’s just the clothes on your back. Seems like the most obvious first step to the concept of “degrowth” to me. I suppose continual consumption could be a bigger deal, but most of that is unavoidable (eating food for example) though you can still optimize it, i feel like that should be much more obvious frankly, considering how much we do it every day at the very least.
i mean yeah, i just don’t know how much one would need to explain the concept of “hey just don’t buy things, or if you do minimize the impact of it.” But that’s just me i suppose.
Thats because degrowth is not just anti consumerism although it is part of it, but to limit economic growth to stay within planetary boundaries. This means that degrowth also wants to built up systems to stop over consumption for everybody, while providing everybody with a good quality of life. This is far from simple, since we currently overuse earths resources, while billions are starving, despite us having enough food to feed everybody with ease. So you end up with stuff like universal basic income, forced recycling systems, commons, global justice, measuring well being and a lot more. There is easily enough to write a book about.
that’s fair i suppose, i wouldn’t call it degrowth though. I’d call it global economic minimalism or something. Degrowth is pretty broad, but then again people probably aren’t going to buy a book titled “economic minimalism” are they? Lol.
If you tried to post a picture. You do so by putting a ! in front of the link like:
Then you get:
Hope that helps, if not ignore it.
I did mean to thanks! Couldn’t get the damn thing to work haha.
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First of all, libraries exist.
that’s true, i forget about them pretty frequently on account of the whole modern society thing. I have no idea if they would even have more recent releases tbh lol.
Though i guess you could probably go through your library to acquire it anyway?
I build or repair for myself where I can.
Just bought a secondhand ssd for my secondhand steam deck. I am now the proud owner of a 512 gb steam deck for sub 300. I love buying the shiny things covered in dust by others
Used stuff is fine and I have a 200 bucks 3D printer for when stuff breaks.
Y’all are no longer buying new stuff to take care of the environment. I’m not buying new stuff because everything costs an arm and a leg plus taxes. We’re not quite the same I guess.
This is news?
Read the name of the group you’re posting in.
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Boop beep I got delete.
Completely agree that making things yourself is a good idea. Food is probably the easiest, as almost all places to live have an entire room with equipment for making and storing food.
Disagree about going to any “prepper” meetups, unless you want to listen to angry people rant about “the government” when they’re really just upset at their ex-wives. Very few preppers learn how to do anything themselves. Buying a pallet of bottled water and a generator is not helping the world.
I hope you feel as stupid as you are for putting those words down in that order. 🤦🏼♂️
Could you self report any harder for reading nothing except the title? Lmao.
Man it just gets dumber the more times I read what you said. I hope you’re at least self aware enough that you don’t consider yourself an intellectual on any level.
Maybe I’d feel differently if I’d read their comment (they deleted it), but that seems a touch harsh. By their comments they don’t seem like a bad person. Maybe it’s just because we’re from the same instance, and I’m not especially smart
It’s not deleted from where I am.
Regurgitating for your enjoyment:
gonna suck when those underwear, sheets, towels get huge holes in them. gonna make their own soap, shampoo, and deodorant? how bout medications, not buying any of those? subway, L, bus tokens? gasoline? bicycles? shoes? smartphones? lol. this should be interesting to watch.
Thanks. That’s short-sighted and gross. This very much goes against the solarpunk aesthetic
Why? Most people are not intellectuals. Lord knows I’m not. But way too many people consider themselves above the curve for intelligence and I don’t think there’s anything wrong with pointing that out.
Then I misunderstood. I thought you meant it as a put down.
Yes, not many of us are intellectuals, it’s true. I still prefer to assume goodwill or a bad day from posters that otherwise seem pretty cool. Treat it as a learning opportunity kind of thing.
