I bet that rich dumb ass would love this comparison.
It’s amazing that it’s been 12 years since Elon had this image deleted from the internet:
How much do clothes cost in the Matrix?
I am thinking about getting robot legs. It’s a risky operation but worth it
please. SIT. on my FACE
Oh shit it’s a new high score. What does that mean?.. did I break it? Cue obnoxiously loud techno
Cost? With the awesome Kung-Fu powers programmed into your mind you can manifest epic clothes like these at will. You just have to cross your arms into a super rad X-shape while you do it.
I forgot it was a direct quote but yeah I had J.P. in mind lol
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Clearly not deleted.
What is the similarity between Musk and Edison?
They both fucked over Tesla
This i like
I can’t believe this is the first time I’ve heard this.
According to Tesla’s autobiography, he said very good things about Edison.
Yeah people are desperate to believe ‘Edison evil, Tesla jesus’ it’s so weird. I get that it was like a cool fact online twenty years ago but there have been so many actual historical documentaries showing how complex and interesting the real story was.
Truth is neither of them invented anything from scratch, - AC generators, motors (useless), transformers, and lights were in use before Tesla even began his big invention. He was a name in a long list of people who worked together understanding the newly emerging field of electronics - if Westinghouse or Barrington had made outrageous claims to allure conspiracy theories then they might have got the Tesla treatment by thy internet instead and we’d only hear of Tesla in the science museum while they’d be regarded at saintly heros of science.
I like Tesla but there are so many interesting stories
electrocuting an elephant to death, and for no better reason than tabloid advertising, kind of stands out in the historical record
that’s not to say Edison was PURE EVIL, just that I always remember the elephant alongside the more humanizing factoids. [Once, he asked a math student to find the volume of a lightbulb. The student started doing all kinds of caliper measurements and geometry calculations. Edison just filled the bulb with sand and tipped it out into a measuring cup]
Except in realityit seems he was against the elephant being killed but said electrocution would be more humane than the hanging which had happened to ‘murderous mary’, his opinion being something the aspca also supported.
The assholes in this story are the themepark owners that upon being unable to sell Topsy decided to kill her as a spectacle to gain publicity, A previous attempt elsewhere to electrocute an elephant had failed so they also used other measures. They poisoned her. Electrocuted her and strangled her with a steam powered winch.
They did use locally supplied power from the Edson Co but this was because it was a decade after war of the currents and Edison was the main supplier of AC to NYC, they certainly weren’t trying to promote its danger. Plus he no longer owned that company, he’d sold to GE and it still used his name.
The Edison film company did film it but again no evidence the man himself was involved, they filmed short clips of specticals and news events which could be viewed in a slot machine. It’s upsetting but people were a lot less caring about animals back then, it wasn’t especially shocking that this happened or was recorded.
if Westinghouse or Barrington had made outrageous claims to allure conspiracy theories then they might have got the Tesla treatment by thy internet instead and we’d only hear of Tesla in the science museum
Hey now, you get to hear about Westinghouse plenty in the railroad museums. A variation of the Westinghouse brake design is still in use on modern trains to this day
He just didn’t understand their american humor
This meme hurts me physically every time it gets reposted. It is not a complete picture of anything, it’s just easy to make people thoughtlessly accept stories if they shit on Elon, who to be clear deserves it. Those two guys were the first guys who started Tesla to bring the work of AC Propulsions to market. They are first and foremost tech millionaires (now quite likely billionaires) and do not deserve idolization either. The engineers of AC Propulsion ie Wally Rippel who also helped design the EV1 are the ones who actually made the technology happen.
The Tesla guys had the idea to put the tzero concept and tech into production shoved into a Lotus Elise and to market it to silicon valley investors as essentially a tech company. Elon was the main investor who went for it, also after speaking to AC Propulsion about putting the tzero into production. The rest is pretty well documented history of Elon being a huge asshole who accomplished very little if anything off his own merit while pushing out everyone around him.
But as far as “These are the real founders of Tesla” goes, the only things they did on their own was suggest AC Propulsions to put the tzero into production a bit sooner than Elon and deciding to create a tech startup to license the tzero technology and put it into a Lotus and style it as a tech company. If you want to inform people of the real heroes behind the electric car and Tesla, teach people about the tzero, AC Propulsion, Wally Rippel, and the other engineers who made the battery electric vehicle a feasible reality.
Perhaps, but the point stands that the specific thing called “Tesla” was founded by these guys, and Musk went through quite some headaches to be retconned as a founder of that thing, so it’s on point to drive it home that he wasn’t even that.
Fair point that “Tesla” isn’t really the great brains behind the original core tech, but that’s not the feather in the cap that Musk was going for, so it’s a bit moot toward the end of undermining his status of “founder” of Tesla.
So the meme isn’t “give the brilliant guy what he deserves” but just “let’s shit on Musk”.
More, “let’s shit on rich assholes that pretend to invent shit that they had nothing to do with.” Edison at least may have had one original thought with the incandescent light bulb filament, but even that one is debatable. Musk is just another rich fuck, like Edison, that has come along to buy and claim credit for tons of shit he never even tangentially thought of.
This meme isn’t about who invented the technology though. Everyone with 0.25 of a brain knows business majors break out in hives when they get that close to actual work. This meme is about who founded the Tesla Motor Corporation, and who demanded credit for having done so despite having done nothing except show up with gobs of money once their business strategy was already proven.
The business strategy wasn’t remotely proven though, it was still just an idea, no part of the car was designed yet. It was two people who had no idea how to design a car doing the groundwork to start a company working with Lotus and AC Propulsion and then a few months later it was three with Ian Wright lending some business work with the relationship between Lotus and AC Propulsion, then a few months later it was four with Elon who lent money and knew about as much about designing a car as the previous three, then a few months later it was five and they finally had a CTO at least.
Fuck them. Starting a private company and then selling it to some tool doesn’t make these guys great people. They exploited their employees and sold the company to some guy to exploit some more. I’m not sympathizing with capitalists because of other capitalists.
I think this post is more about denigrating Elon than celebrating these two.
yeah fair enough. that still implies that there’s something great about founding Tesla. Which could be great, if the founders had sold the company to its employees and made it a co-op!
Ok. Show me how we collectively invest in R&D without IP and build a car company without profits.
Aaaaannnnd go!
Show me how we collectively invest in R&D without IP and build a car company without profits.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_space_program https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Positioning_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Internet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_nuclear_power
Oh look! Government investment!
No government can exist without surpluses generated by the population. There have never been surpluses, except maybe in a few golden areas of abundant rain, without some form of trade and profit i.e. capitalism
investment into worker owned companies is possible. Buying stocks is not the only way to invest and make profit.
If nobody has profits, what is there to invest?
You can make contracts that guarantee a certain percentage of revenue for a certain number if years, or you know, just loans with interest.
Loan what? Banks can only work if someone has already made a profit that they can invest.
if the founders had sold the company to its employees and made it a co-op!
So perform magic? Do you know how the company transferred ownership?
yeah turns out I was misinformed. my bad. But point still stands, they made a private company designed to exploit workers, and some asshole took it over.
I’ve been trying to figure out how to get the worker-owned cooperative model to take over for the capitalist model for a long time. It just seems to be a better outcome for everyone. You can’t squeeze the worker to extract wealth for the shareholders if the only shareholders are the workers. No need to squeeze the customers if there’s no hedge fund bros expecting a 20% return on their capital. But how often are workers going to have the money lying around to buy their company?
The workers may not have been interested in buying and as much as we may hate exploitation by capitalist pigs, it’s unrealistic to expect entrepreneurs to just give it all away. I think we’re still a ways off from the appetite for revolution is large enough to just take it from them. And I’m not sure that would be the right thing to do anyway. We do need people with the skill set to organize businesses and envision products and services. We just don’t need to keep treating such people as demigods. That would be enough revolution for me and they could still be the rich people, just not so grotesquely wealthy while people who make it all possible are struggling.
What I’m thinking of is like an investment fund that provides low-cost financing for groups of employees who are looking to buy their boss’s business, or for start-ups that are looking to organize their business as a worker-owned cooperative. Of course by definition this fund would earn less than market rates. Providing low cost financing is just providing low return investment opportunity from the other side. So investing in it would be more of a charitable contribution than an investment. But I don’t think the system is in place to facilitate financing of worker-owned cooperatives at present. I think a better use of our energies would be to figure out how to make such a framework than just screaming at capitalists. Just my take.
We do need people with the skill set to organize businesses and envision products and services.
That doesn’t really describe capitalists, though. The point about the ownership class is that they’re not really skilled in doing any of this, which is why the economy is organized in the eclectic and idiotic way that it is. I also don’t understand what “envisions products and services” is, as a skill. I think we can all do that, it doesn’t really make it a good or valuable service. Owning class dipshits envision services all the time, are awful at it, and they never end up getting made or doing anything useful.
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It may not describe financiers. I’d say it’s a fair description of entrepreneurs. Just because some people do it poorly doesn’t mean it’s not a skill. Kind of argues that it is, actually. I wholeheartedly agree that having the most money is a horrible qualification for the job. But I maintain that it does need to be done. Myself I would prefer more of the decision making to be collectivized but I don’t think the concept of having business leaders is entirely outmoded.
Edit: plus I was on a bit of a tangent when I wrote that sentence anyway. I need to get better at self-censoring. The point was about how best to be able to serve society’s needs without relying upon rentiers to furnish the means.
People often imagine things they don’t do can’t be that hard. Marketing is important because no one will be interested in your product if no one knows about it. Being able to envision products that the average person will want is another one that good business leaders often do.
Steve Jobs, for example, was very good at envisioning what people would be interested in. From the Apple to Macs to the iPod to the iPhone, he hit a lot of winners. This isn’t an endorsement for him owning the company, or even as a person, but he undeniably had a skillet that others around him often lacked.
I dunno man, I’m really skeptical of Steve Jobs as a big “ideas guy” and I’d probably attribute most of Apple’s success to Steve Wozniak. I’d also wager that the pocket computer + phone revolution was probably inevitable at the point where the iPod and iPhone were coming out, and more long term, Apple’s success in that domain has done a lot of damage to the market with their “trend setting” behaviors.
Steve Wozniak was an amazing computer geek, and designed an incredibly useful computer for the time. Steve Jobs popularized and marketed the idea. He didn’t do a lot on the technical side. There was the Blackberry and resistive touch phones before the iPhone, and they had serious problems. Anyone could have made the first smartphone - Windows Mobile was released in 2003 and certainly had the money to take on this project - but Apple did. And yes, Apple did a lot to make it painful for their customers to stray from the Apple ecology to the company’s benefit, and the detriment to the market as a whole, which is pretty on-brand for Jobs.
Starting a private company and then selling it to some tool doesn’t make these guys great people.
Engineering a practical prototype for an electric sports car in the year 2003 makes you pretty cool, if nothing else.
Lacking the easy access to low-interest credit and being hedged out of the SUV-heavy American car market doesn’t make them bad people.
They exploited their employees and sold the company to some guy to exploit some more
The company had exactly three people in it when Elon Musk arrived with $6.5M in Series A investment cash. They were both forced out of the company in 2008, as the Series B funding was exhausted and Elon was leveraging his fundraising clout to monopolize control of the board. This was long before the Gigafactory and the big labor abuses we’re familiar with today.
I wouldn’t call them geniuses or pretend they were irreplaceable. These were a couple of car hobbyists who stumbled into a cut-throat industry and got their work snatched out from under them.
But then I wouldn’t call the Tesla a particularly amazing piece of technology. Just something a couple of car hobbyists realized was possible with existing technology and made a (small) fortune scaling up.
The real genius in the end was scamming the Department of Energy out of billions of dollars and helping gas guzzlers fake their EV quota.
Engineering a practical prototype for an electric sports car in the year 2003 makes you pretty cool, if nothing else.
Yeah that was AC Propulsion though, and in 1996, and a completely different group of people.
The Tesla guys had the idea of shoving it into a Lotus Elise and marketing it as a tech company.
Could you explain this more?
Starting a private company and then selling it to some tool doesn’t make these guys great people.
Where are you coming up with your narrative about him selling?
“The Tesla cofounder lost his role as CEO of Tesla about three years after Elon Musk began investing in the electric-car maker. Eberhard previously told Insider that Musk and Tesla’s board had met behind his back and voted to replace him as CEO.”
Ohhh, back-stabbing bitches. *grabs popcorn*
For what it’s worth, it’s been suggested that Musk’s takeover of Tesla was opportunistic, and against the desire of Tarpenning and Eberhard.
From my research, Tarpenning was pressured into quitting, and Eberhard was fired by the board of directors for lying to the board. Since Elon was chairman of the board at the time, it’s plausible (and even hinted at) that Elon played dirty to push through this firing.
I cannot say for sure if they would have handled the company more ethically then Musk, but I am personally uncomfortable hanging them out to dry simply on what could have been.
That said, I agree that employee co-ops are a top tier business organization structure.
Contrarian moral posturing with claims of Marxist purity? Surely, you jest!
I feel like I’ve read this before as a strategy in a COINTELPRO document
Moral posturing is a an agent provocateur’s strategy? Can you link the document?
Not only do you sound angry and full of an agenda, you are also wrong about your facts. Are you paid by Elon?
That’s not what really happened though. They needed an investor to get the company off the ground. Musk came in and screwed them out of the company
They didn’t sell it to Elon.
Elon sued them and took Tesla over in court. https://www.theverge.com/23815634/tesla-elon-musk-origin-founder-twitter-land-of-the-giants.
Elon beat them in the court of law, business tactics, and expertly took over the company. What, you think Elon paid for this? He’s smarter than that.
I mean he paid for Twitter and… well…
Yeah, I was gonna say, playing dirty is one thing. Making great business decisions without stepping on people for profit is another thing entirely.
Only after the Delaware court forced him to.
Elon is a jackass who runs over all normal senses of decency while repeatedly getting away with it. And he will continue to do so as long as his legion of asshole internet followers continue to worship him on a wide scale, giving him large benefits in our cultural zeitgeist.
I am happy that people are finally understanding how much of an asshole Elon is today. But he’s been pulling this shit since the dawn of Tesla, as the Tesla takeover court cases proved in the 00s.
Elon threw money at the problem and it worked, as it so often does. Conversely, the tactic failed in the Twitter scenario. That’s his entire game plan for everything, a trait he shares with nearly every other person born with a silver spoon in their mouth.
He bought founder title.
It’s incredible. Musk held all the aces, Tesla, SpaceX, Crypto (debatable). He was viewed as a pioneer, as a philanthropist. But it seems social media fucks up every one of us. Image Nixon, it would have been immensely insightful if we had social media back then EDIT: Nixon would have been a smart Trump, fuck that timeline
It really is incredible, the potential place in history he pissed away. But I guess you can’t end up a multi billionaire if you’re the type of person that knows when it’s OK to stop.
Yeah, there were a few people who knew better that were telling everyone, but no one listened and everyone in the world was lining up to kiss his ass. Putting him in various popular movies and shows as the greatest luminary of our time. While people who knew him were writing credible reports that he is just a very lucky douche who is also a giant megalomanic.
Can’t imagine being his first wife and having her experiences and sharing those experiences and the world seeming to gaslight her that he’s actually a brilliant flawless man.
Nixon Foundation has been posting edits of him on their Youtube channel, tons of pro-Nixon comments
Ironic that the company is named Tesla.
Nikola is probably rolling in his grave. May that glorious man rest in peace.
He was amazing at math and physics, but he was a grade A douchebag.
Was he? As I understand it’s he was not a bit mentally ill
He was, but not due to his OCD. He just straight up hated women. A bit more so than every other man at the time. His autobiography gives his opinion. He hated women, especially if they wore pearls. Which may have been his mental illness flavoring the hate. He also fell in love with a pidgeon. Can’t really blame the fella. Pidgeons are very social animals. Best bird to have as a pet.
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Nicola is spinning so hard in his grave, you can hook it up to a dynamo and supply electricity to a whole town.
I wonder if the original founders named it in honour of Tesla and then elon had to come in and ruin it all
And just like Edison, Elon swooped in and bought up all their IP and took all the credit for their inventions/work.
Edison did it with Nikolas ideas when he was working for him, and now Elon did it with something that was named to honor the man.
Tesla gets shafted yet again.
I can’t help but wonder what he could have accomplished if someone, literally anyone had continued to fund him, and help him continue his efforts for the remainder of his natural life. Maybe we would be flying around in wirelessly powered personal vehicles. Who knows? But the ideas he had led to some of the most significant advances in technology for years. Pretty much our entire modern life is thanks to Tesla’s inventions, either directly or indirectly.
Even something as simple as AC electricity delivery… What a genius. Easily on the top of my list of best inventors.
His personal life and some of his opinions there may have been a bit problematic, but it would be difficult to deny that he was a brilliant inventor.
Apparently Edison wasn’t even the first historical tech bro, but some French dude that eventually killed himself with his “own” invention. And the very first modern techbro was Steve Jobs, who gets cited more and more often as an influence as Elongated Muskrat is becoming more and more far-right.
Was Jobs really a techbro? I usually think of techbros as being fairly political/libertarian (or some interpretation of libertarianism, at any rate), while Jobs was afaik pretty apolitical.
Jobs was the same ilk, he just had better optics at that time. If he lived today, he’d sell out to whatever party they let him to outsource the manufacturing (and coding) to the cheapest possible country. Maybe he’d even double down on the whole AI thing.
Behind the bastards podcast did a four-part series on just how big of a piece of shit Steve Jobs was. We all knew that, but what I didn’t know especially was just how fucking stupid a lot of his business decisions were, coming from his enormous hubris.
Would Elon have fried an elephant with a Tesla car battery nowadays just to make a point how bad the competition is?
Well I bet he would.*
- Edison had technically nothing to do with the killing of Topsy, it was a decade after the ‘war of the currents’. It was distributed through Edison films though.
“They’ll say, “Aw, Topsy,” at my autopsy!”
And Elon is the Musk of our times imo
Edison was a monster. Meme checks out.
They say Thomas Edison
He’s the man to get us
Into this century
And that man is me🎵 They’ll say, “Awwwwww, Topsy!” At my – Auuuuuu-topsy And no one will be… More shocked than me!🎵
They found Tesla but did they found TwitterCars though? And SpaceTwitter huh? DiggerTwitter? See? Not everyone can do 4D Chess like TwitterBoy.
So instead of one dumb guy founding Tesla and running it into the ground, TWO dumb guys gave everything over to another dumb guy to run it into the ground. Masterful gambit !
They still sold out so that Nikola’s name could be dragged down to hell while they sip drinks on the beach. The cost to the rest of us is incalculable.
Just going to leave this here and y’all can do the reading: https://www.cnet.com/culture/tesla-motors-founders-now-there-are-five/
Long story short, one of these two guys was ousted and a lawsuit settlement in 2009 determined that there were five co-founders, including Musk.
Note that the lawsuit didn’t “determine”, it was settled out of court, so there was no determination of fact.
Instead the parties agreed to let Musk call himself a founder for undisclosed terms. Musk basically paid for people to let him use that title as part of the settlement.
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Don’t forget Marconi, he was also a deeply screwed-up individual who betrayed many along the way and thus was undeserving of the Nobel Prize he did receive.
Marconi basically used the patent system to raid British research institutes, violating each and every gentleman’s agreement along the way. And he did it with money from the British postal or telegram offices, who he unceremoniously dumped on the eve of unveiling his wireless contraption.
