I’m not swedish but what are the terms like in the CBA? Will Unions be able to be like “Oh Tesla has good gross margins, how about we force them into an agreement much worse than what Volvo is having” or is it just Elon being Elon?
Just genuinely curious of how things work in Sweden.
It’s the standard IF Metall CBA for car mechanics. It covers things like minimum wage, minimum yearly wage increase (which is usually set to offset inflation, overtime, vacation pay and vacation time (beyond the legal minimum that is) and much, much more. You can find all IF Metalls different CBAs here but they’re all in Swedish though. The one you’d be looking for specifically is, I think, the one called “Motorbranschavtalet”.
Tesla won’t get anything different from what any other car company already has unless they specifically and succesfully negotiate a change to it. Though they don’t have to do that if they don’t want to since negotiations on changes to the CBA happen between employers organisations (which would represent Tesla as well as all the other companies who have signed the CBA) and union organisations (which represent all the unions)
yesterday there was a post that they had backed down. this could almost make me religious. almost. so it continues. cant wait.
Tesla needs to drop prices in Sweden to the point where a lot of people care more about getting the deal than being in solidarity with a handful of steel workers, or in other words vote with their wallets.
Then, when they can’t get their desired cars because of strikes they will change their mind about unions and that will sway public opinion on this issue.
70% of employees are in a union. Public opinion won’t sway, it’s literally how the system works there.
They don’t default to something like the US, where an HR department plays the game of “what are you looking to make” and then has a 1 on 1 sparring match with the employee to try and get them for as low as cost as possible.
It’s expected for employers to negotiate a CBA with the sector employees as a group in order to set wages for set (ex 4 year) time-frames. It’s common in, way the US, for there to be situations where an employee makes 2x the wage of someone else, and then talking about wage is a forbidden topic within a company so it’s a secret. That just doesn’t fly there. There’s a cultural focus on consensus beyond the job market - it’s a cultural foundation, and it’s important for everyone in a group to be on with the structure and transparent about the org.
It’s an entirely different system. Many of the metalworkers are already part of the sector union, Tesla just refuses to meet for setting up the CBA. It’s not a union taking over a company or anything like that. The unions are sector based and already exist, and the workers are already members.
Lol people would go “thanks for the cheap car, now sign the contract with the union.” There would be absolutely no change at all since everyone knows the only two outcomes from this is either Tesla signs the deal or they get the fuck out of the country.
The ruling yesterday was about ordering Transportstyrelsen to allow the plate manufacturer to hand out plates before they go to Postnord.
The ruling today is about what should happen to the plates that already went to Postnord.
The ruling from yesterday is still in effect.
I see no setback.
I see no setback.
I mean it is still an obvious setback since many plates has already gone to Postnord, and those will be stuck there.
28 plates. (Or 28 pairs of plates. I am not sure.)
Here’s how much the Swedish union “cares” about workers: The head of the Swedish Trade Union would rather see those workers without jobs than have Tesla not be in a union. DISGUSTING.
"In an interview, Susanna Gideonsson, who heads the Swedish trade union federation fighting Tesla, sounded remarkably confident. “This will end with the employees winning a collective bargaining agreement, one way or another,” she said. And if they don’t? “Then Tesla can leave the country.” "
That doesn’t say anything about the workers not having jobs.
That’s a denial of the obivious fact that If tesla leaves those worker will be without a job… At Tesla. If Tesla were to shut down it’s business in Sweden, what would happen to the jobs of those people who currently work there (all of them, and not just the mechanics)?
Your seem to be inferring the workers could find jobs elsewhere which is not… insightful. Who would get them those jobs? The union? The union didn’t get them the jobs they have now so…
Is it easy to be cavalier with someone else’s job? It comes down to the scenario’s Fact (they’d have no job at Tesla) Versus the Speculation (They could find another job… somewhere).
Who would get them those jobs?
In the CBA that IF Metall is trying to have Tesla sign there is a part about support if you lose your job (omställningsstöd). It’s an extra safetynet that, and while it doesn’t promise to lead to a new job, it helps you on the way.
At the moment workers at Tesla doesn’t have this, and that is one of the reasons for the strike.
Garbage workers in Toronto would go on strike every 3-4 years just because they could. The union dues covered workers wages during the strike and workers got paid more after the new contract. It got painful for taxpayers for the workers to continually go on strike every few years. The municipal workers were fired and the contract was transferred to a private company.
In Sweden unionized workers can’t strike while their contract is in effect. A CBA, which the workers are asking for, makes it illegal for them to strike unless the CBA is broken by the employer and even then it’s not likely that they’d strike. The CBA has a term limit and when it nears the end they renegotiate.
This is why striking is not very common in the Nordic’s but it is in France.
A private company that is surely doing a much better job and much more cheaply /s
Add to that that the fired workers had to be paid unemployment benefits and then likely got jobs with lower wages, so they pay less taxes, the standard of living of their kids has gone down, etc.
It baffles me how many people think firing workers making a decent (but relatively extremely low) wage to hire workers earning minimum wage and having to work three jobs to survive can be a win for society, but here we are.
There was a lot of crowing by the anti-union crowd just a day ago with the interim decision. Regardless of how this works out in the end, I think this whole episode has made clear if it wasn’t already that the majority of EV buyers and enthusiasts, being upper income people, are remarkably anti-union.
It is truly baffling how people consider the actions of a bunch of rich people (i.e. management at a company) to be justified in anything they do. You will hear the line “They have an obligation to their stockholders”, or just “It’s their money, they can do what they want with it,” in pretty much any scenario where a business does something negative for society or the world at large.
But the second a bunch of workers exercise the absolutely most basic right there is in a free market, that of not working, they are excoriated by these same people. Some of the attitudes in the last thread were as though these workers were withholding medicine for orphans, not just choosing to not work for a company openly hostile to them. Again, Tesla has chosen to do business a certain way, and the workers are choosing to respond. You can debate the legality of both sides however much you want, but it is ridiculous how people put moral judgements out there as if Tesla is owed the labor of Swedish workers.
The hilarious part of this is that of all the striking unions, the postal service is the one that they’ve decided to complain the most about - if I were them, I’d be worrying about companies like Hydro Extrusions, who are the only supplier in Europe for the parts they supply to Giga Berlin, and have announced they’re going to stop production for Tesla this Friday.
It seems we’re swiftly moving from “fuck around” to the “find out” phase.
You have to understand that TSLA shareholders a very vocal part of this community. If you look at the post history of the anti-union commentators, there is almost always some connection to other Tesla shareholding communities.
These people aren’t anti-union because they have deeply held ideological beliefs regarding socioeconomics; they are people with a clear and direct motivation to support Tesla’s profit margin by supporting whatever position is most convenient at the time. There is no separating their belief system from that of the business itself.
I think this whole episode has made clear if it wasn’t already that the majority of EV buyers and enthusiasts, being upper income people, are remarkably anti-union.
American EV buyers.
I mean that’s the case with Sweden too. Tesla is the most popular EV - by far - in Sweden, so clearly its consumers don’t care about unions either and hence the “boot wearers” term.
The union needs to just let the employees vote and stop with the pressure.
Let the employees decide.
What is your source for that 90% number? If it’s from Tesla, I wouldn’t put too much faith in it.
What’s the source for any number. As far as I know there isn’t any.
If there isn’t any in favor or against, maybe one should refrain from using the number from an unreliable source as an argument?
Tesla is claiming 90% are still working, IF Metal is claiming something like 150 people are part of the strike and that tesla is using strikebreakers. I don’t trust IF Metals numbers either.