- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.world
- automotive@discuss.tchncs.de
- cross-posted to:
- technology@lemmy.world
- automotive@discuss.tchncs.de
Ford executives said they have hired 350 veteran engineers — some of them were former employees, while others had been working at suppliers — after artificial intelligence and automated systems failed to deliver the desired quality level.
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Really shows how a lot of executives out there are just as dumb as any person, believing AI fully replaces humans.
No, they are worse.
The lack the detail knowledge about what (current) AI is, are therefor under heavy influence of corporate salespeople and have the constant pressure of making more money.
And are insulated from consequences because they occupy the privileged positions where when you massively fuck up everyone knows you’re still one of the good guys and you were really trying out there so you get to keep your job or you get a nice cushy pay package and some nice PR about parting ways
I don’t know if this one can be chalked up to straight stupidity. It’s only ever about quarterly earnings.
These execs are mostly Boomers who have no idea how AI works. They saw it as a party trick and were amazed, then assholes like Bill Gates are telling them AI will wipe our asses in three years. They had FOMO, like when they ran into the EV space to make those Tesla profit margins. Who cares, they rotate out in 5 years rich either way.
Yeah, so that’s two dumb things now: One, believing the hype that AI can fully replace a human worker, and two, that it will be cheaper (tokenmaxxing go brr).
But they’re paid according to the value they bring the company!
/s
Wow, the clankers couldn’t measure up to experienced engineers? Who could have possibly seen that coming? Why didn’t someone warn someone about that?
I love how you got down voted for telling the truth And For you adding a small amount of sarcasm into the comment. I’m thinking it’s a pro AI person.
Some Tesla driving knuckle dragger with a MAGA hat that takes naps while their car drives on autopilot.
There’s always an asshole downvote.
or two.
see?
The best AI could come up with was plastic oil pans, which are all failing.
Plastic oil pans were a thing long before AI
So were cam belts in oil. Ford has always been a shit company with second rate engineering. Thankfully they don’t make sedans any more.
Yeah, it’s much better that they’re engineering only huge trucks and SUVs capable of flattening whole families when systems fail.
Those engineers should have formed a union and refused until they could collectively negotiate their pay. I can’t think of a more straightforward situation in which a union would be more appropriate.
Many Detroit engineers are in UAW.
I would be surprised if they weren’t part of the UAW. Many states are “At-Will” and don’t have exceptions for union protections.
Michigan is an at-will state however there are still limits on what employers can do.
Many states are “At-Will”
I love how even China has better worker protections than the “land of the free”…
You’re 100% free. Free of worker protections. Duh.
The CBA with the union provides the protections. The bare minimum the state requires for everyone isn’t all that relevant when you have a negotiated contract for much more than that bare minimum, whether it’s for-cause termination protections, mandatory notice and severance pay for layoffs, etc.
That’s what I was trying to say though, in states like mine between the at-will law and the right-to-work law there is basically no way for unions to include that in a contract in an enforceable way. Effectively even if your union contract included for cause termination protections you would have to both prove that you were terminated not for cause (which in my state can include things like “does not fit in with work culture“) and litigate that yourself assuming your employment contract or union contract doesn’t include some sort of binding arbitration agreement with your employer. And that’s putting aside that union membership in my state is incredibly low due to the right-to-work law.
Better yet, form a Contracting Firm, with all members as partners, and the Company can hire the firm, who will provide all services.
Pay the engineers at triple their original rate, and charge the company 6x, and save the excess. As cost overruns, and special services with higher costs, are factored in, the excess can be paid out to the partners as quarterly or end of the year bonuses. Maybe make the Company give each engineer a brand new top of the line vehicle of their choice, as well.
The company DESERVES to be abused, they EARNED it. Stick it to them ruthlessly.
I hope those engineers managed to get a big raise, because Ford will try that again soon.
They’ve said they’re hiring them back specifically to train and help their automated model/systems
I hope they’re smart enough to poison them so jr engineers can get a foot in the door behind them.
I’m guessing “gray beard” also means they pulled engineers out of retirement or those close to retirement so that they can reduce the work force through attrition.
The plan is to have the grey beards train the people who will train the AI.
No where near enough data to train AI.
It is for fine tuning an existing model.
And those engineers asked for triple pay, right? Right?
And the executives that made the initial decision were fired right? Right?
So is the 2027 f350 full of vibe code and shoddy designs then?
It takes a few years for companies to admit this jind of stuff so I assume the 26 and 25 years were vibe code crappified too.
Oh sure, but not gay beards? Fucking racists.
Aren’t beards already gay?
Gay is a race now…
To be clear, this doesn’t mean Ford is abandoning its AI plans entirely. Instead, it’s using the rehired employees — referred to as “gray beard” engineers — to train younger staff and reprogram AI tools.
Sounds… Ominous.
Heh, bet those engineers know exactly how much they matter to the company now. Nothing.
Or everything, which is why they asked for triple pay on rehire. I hope.
A company is nothing without it’s workers, a simple mass strike would debilitate any company. Let alone a mass walkout, like these companies deserve
I’m not a believer, but Amen to that.
Hmmm sounds like you have to just accept and invest in your training pool to ensure the long term health of your company. Once these guys are gone again, they won’t have anyone to turn to, to fix their mistakes.
Long term thinking? That’s crazy talk! Line must go up now!
I work for a legacy manufacturing company, big name, you’d know it, but this kind of situation that happened to Ford is one of my biggest fears. I got the opportunity to be the youngest person in the room with guys with 20+ yoe and I got to learn from osmosis for years. Now I’m 10+ years myself, and not many of the old guys left and not a lot of young people either. So if they don’t invest in the talent pool, it’s going to sink our ship in ~15 years.
Yeah, you’re fucked. In our current economic system it’s basically impossible to think on these kind of time horizons.
on the other hand, Ford clearly does not understand how to design or manufacture vehicles because China already does it better despite Ford’s 100 year head start.
There is a lot of stupid shit in US automotive engineering that is only done for historic reasons…like why does every model need unique handles, switches, knobs, etc.
Yeah, because some Americans make fun of Toyota for doing that because they think it’s lazy.
The only way they would re-hiring ME is as a contractor. My rate would be at least 3 times my previous, hourly rate, I will set strict limits on my hours and you will pay me at the end of each day. In cash.
Hey, I’ve seen this movie.
‘Desk Set’ with Tracey and Hepburn. Tracey is a computer expert trying to replace Hepburn’s team of researchers.
