Imagine if Microsoft banned Windows users from downloading software outside the Microsoft.
Imagine if Microsoft required all Software developers to give them 30% of the money they earn.
This is nothing but pure extortion.
Opening up app stores gives users choices. If you want to pay a 30% up charge for the privilege of having Apple take your money instead of, say, Stripe, be my guest. But no hardware manufacturer should have the right to jail users.
There is no restriction on Macs, which is equivalent to Windows. You picked Microsoft just to make a straw man argument.
We need to see these changes across all mobile devices and gaming consoles. All of them are charging around 30% fee and devices are locked in. Hope this is just the beginning.
Device lock-in is a symptom of a wider issue: the users are not in control of their computing. Charging for services is fine but a company deciding what you are allowed to do with your own property is unjust.
Change their post to say Microsoft’s old phone brand OS instead of desktop Windows and what changes? You don’t need to pick an equivalent to highlight a single aspect for comparison when arguing for a position.
Microsoft old phone OS is not really relevant because I don’t even know if they make them anymore. My point was that Windows was picked to make a straw man argument. The argument will obviously stand because all other mobile devices and consoles are locked in.
I’m aware, I just said you are not restricted to an App Store on macOS. Isn’t that the whole point of this?. Apple only restricts their mobile devices and iPads.
I’m also not offended, I would love to install everything on my phone and not buy different devices but it seems like people think I’m defending the restrictions. I had to buy a steamdeck because I can’t emulate on my iPhone. I just made a comment about singling out Windows comparing to iOS.
Imagine if Microsoft banned Windows users from downloading software outside the Microsoft store.
That was comparing desktop OS to mobile OS, which is why the person to which I replied pointed out this is different than macOS.
On your second point, neither is iOS a workstation, and one could just as easily say, “The only thing you’d want to install is mobile apps.” Okay but the problem isn’t the type of apps, it is the source of those apps. So either you should be able to get application / games from multiple sources or not.
If you think those initial downvotes were due to some pedantic distinction about workstation, and not because somebody indirectly implied that Microsoft and Apple were on similar footing in this regard, fine.
Yes it is. It’s a general computing device. The XBOX is a dedicated gaming device.
Okay but the problem isn’t the type of apps
As far as this discussion, it very much is.
So either you should be able to get application / games from multiple sources or not.
You absolutely should be able to on all platforms, but some are more important than others and comparing them like they’re all the same makes no sense.
Microsoft bans Xbox users from downloading unlicensed software.
I’m curious what that would even look like. The only thing you can install on an Xbox is Xbox games, where are you getting the Xbox games from if not the official publisher?
A duopoly doesn’t require a 50/50 market share. It simply requires them to be the only real options and to both engage in similar anti-consumer practises.
Doubtful. These numbers provided are completely wrong. Back when files where leaked during this very trial, Epic revealed they had 3 to 4 times more players on Playstations than Xboxes everywhere other than the US.
I don’t like Microsoft, and I agree sideloading should be a thing on colsoles too, but they definitely do not hold a majority of the console market, let alone a monopoly.
Additionally looking at the faq for that site it appears to get its data via page views. What % of console users actually use the browser? Is bet very few. Especially when you consider the ps5 has no built in browser.
The only reason these things haven’t happened is that Microsoft was banned from doing them back in the 90s. They absolutely wanted to require a Microsoft Account (then called a Passport) in Windows XP. The ban was in place until just after Windows 7 came out.
Blame the government for doing nothing to protect consumers since 1999.
Imagine if Microsoft banned Windows users from downloading software outside the Microsoft.
Imagine if Microsoft required all Software developers to give them 30% of the money they earn.
This is nothing but pure extortion.
Opening up app stores gives users choices. If you want to pay a 30% up charge for the privilege of having Apple take your money instead of, say, Stripe, be my guest. But no hardware manufacturer should have the right to jail users.
There is no restriction on Macs, which is equivalent to Windows. You picked Microsoft just to make a straw man argument.
We need to see these changes across all mobile devices and gaming consoles. All of them are charging around 30% fee and devices are locked in. Hope this is just the beginning.
Device lock-in is a symptom of a wider issue: the users are not in control of their computing. Charging for services is fine but a company deciding what you are allowed to do with your own property is unjust.
Change their post to say Microsoft’s old phone brand OS instead of desktop Windows and what changes? You don’t need to pick an equivalent to highlight a single aspect for comparison when arguing for a position.
Microsoft old phone OS is not really relevant because I don’t even know if they make them anymore. My point was that Windows was picked to make a straw man argument. The argument will obviously stand because all other mobile devices and consoles are locked in.
There’s no need to get offended. Replace MS with MacOS and the point stands.
Not really, because they both are desktop OS. Everyone knows there is no restriction on MacOS.
But they don’t know about Windows? Do you have any idea what Windows market share looks like?
I’m aware, I just said you are not restricted to an App Store on macOS. Isn’t that the whole point of this?. Apple only restricts their mobile devices and iPads. I’m also not offended, I would love to install everything on my phone and not buy different devices but it seems like people think I’m defending the restrictions. I had to buy a steamdeck because I can’t emulate on my iPhone. I just made a comment about singling out Windows comparing to iOS.
They didn’t single anything out. It was one on many potential examples (such as MacOS).
I guess it’s my bad then!
Apple doesn’t ban Mac users from downloading software outside the App Store.
Microsoft bans Xbox users from downloading unlicensed software.
That this completely true observation has twice the downvotes than upvotes highlights this community’s views on Apple.
No one was talking about Mac.
XBOX is not a workstation. The only thing you’d want to install on it is games. That’s like, the whole point.
That was comparing desktop OS to mobile OS, which is why the person to which I replied pointed out this is different than macOS.
On your second point, neither is iOS a workstation, and one could just as easily say, “The only thing you’d want to install is mobile apps.” Okay but the problem isn’t the type of apps, it is the source of those apps. So either you should be able to get application / games from multiple sources or not.
If you think those initial downvotes were due to some pedantic distinction about workstation, and not because somebody indirectly implied that Microsoft and Apple were on similar footing in this regard, fine.
It doesn’t matter. The point stands.
Yes it is. It’s a general computing device. The XBOX is a dedicated gaming device.
As far as this discussion, it very much is.
You absolutely should be able to on all platforms, but some are more important than others and comparing them like they’re all the same makes no sense.
Sure, Jan.
Or we’re just annoyed with random whataboutisms.
They were replying to the comparison to Windows. What are you on about?
Mm yeah, I probably missed that while scrolling
I’m curious what that would even look like. The only thing you can install on an Xbox is Xbox games, where are you getting the Xbox games from if not the official publisher?
The Xbox doesn’t have the majority of the gaming market.
The smartphone market is basically a duopoly.
Noe does iOS, Android has the vast majority of the smartphone market
A duopoly doesn’t require a 50/50 market share. It simply requires them to be the only real options and to both engage in similar anti-consumer practises.
This says Xbox has over 60% of global market share:
https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/console/worldwide/
Doubtful. These numbers provided are completely wrong. Back when files where leaked during this very trial, Epic revealed they had 3 to 4 times more players on Playstations than Xboxes everywhere other than the US.
Accorsing to Statista (accesible on a third party site if you want to avoid registring), Xbox only has 23% of the market (as opposee to PS’s 45% and Nintendo’s 27%).
I don’t like Microsoft, and I agree sideloading should be a thing on colsoles too, but they definitely do not hold a majority of the console market, let alone a monopoly.
Tbh I think that data is incredibly misleading. Every single generation of PlayStation has outsold the Xbox of the same generation(yes even the ps3) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_game_consoles.
Additionally looking at the faq for that site it appears to get its data via page views. What % of console users actually use the browser? Is bet very few. Especially when you consider the ps5 has no built in browser.
Fair enough.
I think hardware companies should make money selling devices. They should be banned from jailing their users in a locked proprietary ecosystem.
The only reason these things haven’t happened is that Microsoft was banned from doing them back in the 90s. They absolutely wanted to require a Microsoft Account (then called a Passport) in Windows XP. The ban was in place until just after Windows 7 came out.
Blame the government for doing nothing to protect consumers since 1999.
So basically Windows in S mode?
At least you could disable S mode
On X86 only I think.
This isn’t the EU, this is the US. Epic Games will be back in the App Store in US next week.