You hexbears and gradists are so bent on this autocratic ‘dictatorship of the prolitariat’ idea that you could almost replace all energy needs by just hooking up a dynamo to Marx turning around in his grave.
We’re fully aware that DoTP is a transitory step in the path to full stateless classless communism, I’m just engaging with conceit the meme makes to dispute the point those who make ‘cOmMuNiSm oNlY wOrKs On PaPeR’ arguments think they’re making
The problem with those transitory step countries is that it has a ruling class with very different class interests and the same money funneling just like in a capitalist state which basically guarantees that they will never be socialist.
You see no difference in a government made to be a mediating entity between private interests where the source of power lies, and a government that’s self interested and is where power lies? You see nothing but a flattened “they both did taxes and the leadership class has privileges”?
No, taxes are quite helpful to maintain public infrastructure for example. What I’m saying is that every time one of those transitory governments have popped up the leadership ends up ruling the population with an iron fist and horrible corruption that has benefitted mostly the ruling party and rarely anyone else. Pretty much exactly like a capitalist state but with gulags and no voting.
the leadership ends up ruling the population with an iron fist and horrible corruption that has benefitted mostly the ruling party and rarely anyone else
On the second point you’re so wrong it requires no discussion. In the 20th and 21st centuries the countries that had the greatest reduction of poverty in the world are the USSR and the PRC respectively. Whatever definition of ‘corruption’ you have, the fact that those governments not only benefited their people but benefited them more than any other nation on the planet is not a debatable point.
So what exactly do you mean “iron fist”? Are you from the US? Because if you’re saying it from the perspective of the most intrusive surveillance state in history and the largest police state in history, I feel like we’re going to have to sort our semantics.
I’m from one of the countries the USSR did their imperialism on so I’m definitely going to take issue with your assertion that they benefitted their people more than any other country. They benefitted the people in Russia by draining resources from satellite states.
By iron fist I mean the people who spoke out against their regime were either executed outright, worked to death or near death. And by corruption I mean any wealth went straight into the pockets of party leaders and members.
Also why does everyone who defend the USSR go into US bad dialogue tree instantly? Like I really don’t give shit about the US and I’m sure it’s bad too, but that completely irrelevant. At least the US doesn’t generally outright annex countries to do imperialism.
You hexbears and gradists are so bent on this autocratic ‘dictatorship of the prolitariat’ idea that you could almost replace all energy needs by just hooking up a dynamo to Marx turning around in his grave.
We’re fully aware that DoTP is a transitory step in the path to full stateless classless communism, I’m just engaging with conceit the meme makes to dispute the point those who make ‘cOmMuNiSm oNlY wOrKs On PaPeR’ arguments think they’re making
I get it. My point is different. Communism has never been realized, therefore there’s nothing to say about it’s functionality.
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The problem with those transitory step countries is that it has a ruling class with very different class interests and the same money funneling just like in a capitalist state which basically guarantees that they will never be socialist.
You see no difference in a government made to be a mediating entity between private interests where the source of power lies, and a government that’s self interested and is where power lies? You see nothing but a flattened “they both did taxes and the leadership class has privileges”?
No, taxes are quite helpful to maintain public infrastructure for example. What I’m saying is that every time one of those transitory governments have popped up the leadership ends up ruling the population with an iron fist and horrible corruption that has benefitted mostly the ruling party and rarely anyone else. Pretty much exactly like a capitalist state but with gulags and no voting.
deleted by creator
On the second point you’re so wrong it requires no discussion. In the 20th and 21st centuries the countries that had the greatest reduction of poverty in the world are the USSR and the PRC respectively. Whatever definition of ‘corruption’ you have, the fact that those governments not only benefited their people but benefited them more than any other nation on the planet is not a debatable point.
So what exactly do you mean “iron fist”? Are you from the US? Because if you’re saying it from the perspective of the most intrusive surveillance state in history and the largest police state in history, I feel like we’re going to have to sort our semantics.
I’m from one of the countries the USSR did their imperialism on so I’m definitely going to take issue with your assertion that they benefitted their people more than any other country. They benefitted the people in Russia by draining resources from satellite states. By iron fist I mean the people who spoke out against their regime were either executed outright, worked to death or near death. And by corruption I mean any wealth went straight into the pockets of party leaders and members.
Also why does everyone who defend the USSR go into US bad dialogue tree instantly? Like I really don’t give shit about the US and I’m sure it’s bad too, but that completely irrelevant. At least the US doesn’t generally outright annex countries to do imperialism.
Gulags
Cue laugh track