• darq@kbin.social
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    1 year ago

    Unless you’re politically well connected or have nine figures in the bank, you aren’t wielding significant power to make systemic changes.

      • darq@kbin.social
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        1 year ago

        You know that UBI is cheaper than policing the problems that runaway wealth disparity causes, right? UBI also means that employers cannot easily exploit workers with the threat of destitution, meaning that wages, including yours, go up. It also makes society more pleasant as people with prospects turn to drugs or crime less frequently.

        The only people UBI doesn’t benefit, is the absurdly wealthy. Your myopic worldview has you voting against your own interests.

        • HughJanus@lemmy.ml
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          1 year ago

          No, I don’t know any of that.

          Maybe you’d like to explain who and why people would choose to work when they entirely don’t have to?

          • bane_killgrind@lemmy.ml
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            1 year ago

            Same reason people have hobbies… they like doing things.

            What your concern really should be is, who would work for an asshole like you when they don’t have to. The answer is they won’t, get fucked.

            • HughJanus@lemmy.ml
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              1 year ago

              Same reason people have hobbies… they like doing things.

              LOL your hobbies are not work…

                • HughJanus@lemmy.ml
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                  1 year ago

                  Possibly, but they wouldn’t do it 8 hours/day by choice. Anyone who has made what they love doing into their job will tell you this.

                  Nobody picks up garbage for fun. Whos going to pick up the garbage? Who’s going to wait tables? Who’s going to be a nurse?

                  • bane_killgrind@lemmy.ml
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                    1 year ago

                    Antisocial people, prosocial people, and people that want to be nurses?

                    You wouldn’t drive a garbage truck? Think about the things you could watch get crushed.

                    If your only motivation to do things is survival you lead a sad life.

                    You bring up another point, a lot of stuff doesn’t need to be done 8 hours a day.

                  • ASeriesOfPoorChoices@lemmy.world
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                    1 year ago

                    Lots of people pick up garbage “for fun”. Where “for fun” means “because they care and it’s the right thing to do”. And by lots, I mean it’s such a common thing there are thousands of organisations around the world who do it. There are multiple national days in many, many countries based around picking up garbage. I myself have organised several beach clean-ups for a local group as part of a larger nation-wide beach clean up day.

                    Look up the organisation “Trash Hero” for another example.

                    Then there’s the engineers who work on ways to clean up the Pacific Garbage Patch.

                    There’s people who clean up slobs’ tables in fast food places because it doesn’t take any extra time to help out when you were going to do it anyway.

                    The point is: who picks up garbage for fun? Everyone else but you.

                    As for nurses… there are huge international volunteer organisations based around doctors and nurses volunteering their time. How have you never heard of any of this before?

          • darq@kbin.social
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            1 year ago

            Maybe you’d like to explain who and why people would choose to work when they entirely don’t have to?

            Two reasons:

            1. UBI provides a baseline level of income to keep people out of poverty. But people tend to want more than just the basics, and deciding to work provides additional income for luxuries.
            2. People, in general, are inherently motivated to create, and will do so without the threat of death on the streets. Meaning people will still voluntarily work, only they will do so on their terms.

            But also, with the increasing levels of automation possible, human labour is needed less and less to fulfil our needs. We need to decouple being able to live from employment. Because the path we are currently on involves artificially increasing consumption and creating meaningless jobs to justify paying people enough money to live.

            • HughJanus@lemmy.ml
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              1 year ago

              people tend to want more than just the basics, and deciding to work provides additional income for luxuries.

              Doubt.

              We need to decouple being able to live from employment.

              Well it’s a nice utopian thought but not realistic.

              • darq@kbin.social
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                1 year ago

                Doubt

                What do you mean doubt? That people often choose to work more to afford more stuff is utterly uncontroversial. That’s how the capitalist system is argued in favour of today.

                On the other hand if you are admitting that capitalism forces people to labour under the threat of death, then it is an evil system, and morally must be eradicated.

                Well it’s a nice utopian thought but not realistic.

                Because of troglodytes like yourself. Here I thought you were asking in good faith. Serves me right.

                • HughJanus@lemmy.ml
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                  1 year ago

                  That people often choose to work more to afford more stuff is utterly uncontroversial.

                  No. It isn’t. Some people? Sure. Many people already live off of welfare and already choose not to work.

                  Because of troglodytes like yourself.

                  The personal attacks are uncalled for…

                  Here I thought you were asking in good faith.

                  And now you think I’m not? Why? Because I didn’t roll over and agree with everything you said?

                  • darq@kbin.social
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                    1 year ago

                    No. It isn’t. Some people? Sure. Many people already live off of welfare and already choose not to work.

                    Yes. It is utterly uncontroversial. Most people aspire to have some luxuries in their life. And people go the extra mile to afford them. The fact that some people are on welfare, which often effectively prohibits even small amounts of work those people might otherwise want to do, doesn’t change that.

                    And who cares if some small proportion of people just want the basics and aren’t willing to work more? Do you literally want to force them with death to make them work? Why? They don’t want to be there, they’re unhappy to be there, they aren’t motivated, they aren’t productive. And I don’t blame them!

                    And now you think I’m not? Why? Because I didn’t roll over and agree with everything you said?

                    Because you responded to something easily observable with the brainless “doubt”.

                    You are either trolling or just remarkably stupid. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt.